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+--- Thread: Ratification of Expense Reimbursement and Discount Policy (/showthread.php?tid=1936)
- Phokaioglaukos - 10-09-2009
The Policy is on the web site, and has been for weeks. Look for the Minutes area--I cannot link to it directly.
The vote on the policy will be in the minutes that I finalized this morning. As soon as Peter can do so he will post to the web site also.
- LouZ - 10-09-2009
Phokaioglaukos wrote:
Quote:LouZ wrote:Quote:Since we don't know what the "discount" amounts to, it difficult for us to determine if the policy is fair. I do not object, if within reason. We still have this debate, both here and on Rennlist, about Instructor discounts!
More importantly - shall we assume that these "disinterested" directors will NEVER be granted a discount (otherwise, would it be a conflict of interest)?
Why do you say that? The Policy is published on the web site. The Officer's discount is the same as the Instructor's discount, about 50% in most cases.
Yes, the people who gave up the Officer's discount will never get it. Of course they are all Instructors so they can get that discount, as long as it exists AND they actually instruct at a DE event.
Chris, I state it because it is ambiguous!!!
Indicated below is the Policy:
Instructors. [size=3]Persons who are qualified by the Track Chair and who instruct students at a Driver Education ("DE") event are entitled to a discount (the "Instructor’s Discount") in an amount set from time to time by the Track Chair and approved by the Board. The Instructor’s Discount applies to an entire DE event fee, not fewer than all days of a multi-day event. (In recent years the Instructor’s Discount has been about 50% of the regular price of a DE event.) Instructors who instruct at a DE event but do not drive in the event are entitled to a 100% discount.
[/size]Officers. [size=3]The Club’s Officers and Appointed Officers are entitled to the Instructor’s Discount whether or not they are also instructors. The Officers of the Club are currently the President, Vice President, Secretary, Treasurer, Social Chair, Membership Chair, Der Gasser Editor, Autocross Chair, Track Chair, Technical Chair, Goodie Store Proprietor and Webmaster. The Appointed Officers of the Club are currently the Historians, Safety Chair, Co-Safety Chair, Co-Track Chair, Rally Master, Chief Instructor, Registrar, Co-Registrar, Community Service, Awards and Photo Editor. If an Officer or Appointed Officer does not drive at a DE event he or she may assign the Instructor’s Discount for that DE event to his or her spouse.
[/size]
- Phokaioglaukos - 10-09-2009
Lou, it's a policy designed to be adopted by the Board once and then operate without Board action. If we wrote the discount amount into the policy it would have to be amended for some number of DE events every year because the discount for Instructors does vary. If you want to know the discount that the Instructors get for any particular DE event, I think you can see it on motorsportreg.com and I know you can get it from Myles, our Track Chair. I'd tell you what it is for the MAW DE coming up at Thunderbolt if I knew, but since I'm not instructing there I do not know what it is. I do know that it's pretty close to 50% based on what Myles has told me he does.
There is no secret in what the discount is--it just varies from event to event by some amount sometimes and we wanted a policy for the Officers that did not need to be adjusted every month.
Does that make sense?
- LouZ - 10-09-2009
Phokaioglaukos wrote:
Quote:Does that make sense?
Chris
Now it does. Thanks for the clarification.
- catchacab - 10-09-2009
Chris,
Sorry for all of my questions, but since I am not a legal ace like you, I have more questions.
If we take Allison or Peter as an example, who are not currently RTR DE instructors. If they decided that they wanted to vote for the policy instead of abstaining (just assuming that they abstained), would they have forfeited their right to the discount?
- Phokaioglaukos - 10-09-2009
Betsi's point, which is a reasonably technical one but not at all wrong, was that under our conflict of interest policy conflicts must be approved by disinterested directors after full disclosure. For any director to vote for director compensation that director must not, under a strict reading of our policy, benefit from that compensation. To the extent a DE discount is compensation, then the discount for directors had to be approved by directors who gave up the discount.
For Allison, for example, it's more that she could not vote for the policy unless she made it inapplicable to her.
I say this is all quite technical because boards of directors of corporations vote themselves compensation (the real cash and stock kind, not just discounts) all the time. Even, I'd wager, in Betsi's company. We had the opportunity to address this by having those directors who were also instructors give up the director discount. That means they need to instrtuct to get any discount, but they do that anyway, at least as far as I know. I instruct (when I'm in the US) because it's a way of giving back to the Club and all the instructors who helped me.
It's 1:28 AM now, so I'm off to bed. Good night.
- dmano - 10-09-2009
Ok I will say it on this posting also there should be no politics in a car club. Is this a car club or a political forum where everyone is a member of congress. I understand there has to be some leadership but come on folks when I come on here to see whats up I feel like I just attended a session of congress and got shafted along the way. There should not be any political BS in a car club. If there is there are too many Chiefs and not enough Indians. What happened to good old car talk, Oops I forgot this is the Capital Hill forum not a car club forum.
- TwentySix - 10-10-2009
dmano wrote:
Quote:Ok I will say it on this posting also there should be no politics in a car club. Is this a car club or a political forum where everyone is a member of congress. I understand there has to be some leadership but come on folks when I come on here to see whats up I feel like I just attended a session of congress and got shafted along the way. There should not be any political BS in a car club. If there is there are too many Chiefs and not enough Indians. What happened to good old car talk, Oops I forgot this is the Capital Hill forum not a car club forum.
Ironic
![[Image: rolleyes.gif]](http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/src:forums.rennlist.com/get/rennforums/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif)
[size=2]http://rtr.mywowbb.com/forum26/1230.html[/size]
http://rtr.mywowbb.com/forum26/1253.html
http://rtr.mywowbb.com/forum26/1340.html
http://rtr.mywowbb.com/forum26/1365.html
http://rtr.mywowbb.com/forum26/1355.html
http://rtr.mywowbb.com/forum26/1417.html
http://rtr.mywowbb.com/forum26/1424.html
http://rtr.mywowbb.com/forum26/1439.html
- emayer - 10-10-2009
Chris,
I know we discussed some alternative strategies of reimbursement for DE on other threads, and this conversation is perhaps better to set aside until the next exec is elected. That said, and with the potential conflicts correctly pointed out by Betsi, has anyone considered having the general membership vote to ratify any further changes to the bylaws? It may be a bit more cumbersome, but would be the most transparent mechanism.
- dmano - 10-10-2009
Sure it was Ironic but that was for electing the President of the USA not a car club, big difference. Are you saying that this is as important as running the country? This is a CAR CLUB were people are supposed to enjoy their cars. During the Presidential election we had some great discussions about who would be best for the "country" not the car club. So far has our Obama done anything good NOT YET. But he did win a bogus peace prize if that makes you happy.